This is a very good observation:
SHOT Operators Grant

I can understand Grant’s disappointment. I have illusions that somebody other than KelTec or Hi Point will come up with a home defense carbine in pistol caliber that is reasonably priced right under $500 for home defense/truck gun.  Alas, what you can only get is expensive AR-based carbines that go play in the $1k neighborhood.

I think that the last bastion of Gun Culture 1.0 that remains is the concept that what the military and police get, is what people will buy. If Seal Team 36 1/2 or Delta Chi Beta Boyz buy somebody’s particular gun or knife, that supposedly becomes the new standard and civilians will flock to gun stores demanding it.

That line of thought ignores what has happened in the last 5 to 7 years. It is not the big service pistol the one that has been sold like crazy to civilians but instead it has been the much hated Taurus Judge and the compact and sub compact striker-fired pistols for concealed carry, not quite abundant in the armories of any military or police department anywhere.

I will predict that the first company that starts to offer a reliable production of a decent looking semi-auto carbine without proprietary magazines, will make a boatload of money, specially if it is a take-down model or offers both.

Also, bolt-action rifle in .308 with an 16 inch threaded barrel (and with rail or tapped & drilled for it) so the buyer can play Barbie and build up his own scout rifle? Savage Axis with a 22 inch retails for $370 so don’t tell me it can’t be done.

Inertia is a hard to get it moving, even in our circles. Colt chose to ignore the public for the government buck and we have been regaled to its telenovela episodes of woe dealing with bankruptcy.

Take heed.

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By Miguel.GFZ

Semi-retired like Vito Corleone before the heart attack. Consiglieri to J.Kb and AWA. I lived in a Gun Control Paradise: It sucked and got people killed. I do believe that Freedom scares the political elites.

15 thoughts on “Gun Culture 2.0: Vendors Beware (Remember Colt)”
  1. Just became aware at a match of the Just Right carbine 9mm, .40 cal, 45 cal. $650, (9mm) ran flawlessly during the match. Totally ambidextrous. Uses Glock mags. Well worth a look. And this is coming from someone who recently dropped $1600 on a JP Enterprises 9mm, and it is a fine firearm too.

  2. You can build a quality AR chambered in 5.56 for under $600 – however that requires time and knowledge that often the person who is new to guns won’t have.

    As far as pistol-caliber carbines, I saw a Beretta Cx4 in 9mm on Armslist for $600 in St Pete.
    On the Cx4s, the mags are proprietary only in the sense that they only work with the companion Px4 pistol as well.

  3. Here, here! On a corollary vein, firearms training courses seem to follow a similar angle. On one end, the super simple basics classes run by the NRA, and classes that seem to be for training to do wet work in some back water nation with nothing in between. I’d just like to be a bit more proficient at my marksmanship! Is that too much to ask?

  4. Yeah. Something in 9mm or .45acp, with a locked-breech design so someone with not-so-strong hands doesn’t have to wrestle a heavy recoil spring AND you get the most out of the cartridge. That’d make a lot of people happy.

  5. “I will predict that the first company that starts to offer a reliable production of a decent looking semi-auto carbine without proprietary magazines, will make a boatload of money, specially if it is a take-down model or offers both.”

    *fixes an intent gaze upon Marlin…* A modern Camp series utilizing Glock mags? Yes Please. Hell, Ruger could do much the same, churning out a 45 and/or 9mm based on an upsized 10/22 take-down platform. Either would be handy enough to fit the bill and neither would fall under ‘EBR’ appearance criteria.

    (personally I’m a 1911 fanboi, but it’s hard to argue with readily available double stack magazine)

  6. “A modern Camp series utilizing Glock mags? Yes Please.”

    There was a company making aftermarket magwell/trigger housings for Camp 9s that took Glock mags. Unfortunately, both the Camp and this housing are no longer in production.

    FWIW, I have a Camp 9 that has been great — super-reliable, accurate, and a pleasure to shoot.

  7. Not related to the discussion at hand, but does anyone else hit “reply” and have the comment NOT be indented and threaded below the comment you’re trying to reply to? I’ve had this issue every time. I’m on Firefox, FWIW. I tried to reply to my Camp 9 comment above — we’ll see if it works this time.

      1. Miguel, limiting the indents makes sense, but what I’m talking about is that ANY reply I do (even if it’s the first reply to a comment) is not indented/threaded, but is posted as a separate comment. In each case, I’m hitting “REPLY,” not “Post Comment.” This isn’t the end of the world, of course — just annoying when one is trying to keep a sub-thread coherent.

        My post time-stamped “January 25, 2016 at 10:52 am” was a reply to Phssthpok at “January 25, 2016 at 10:38 am” and was not indented.

        My post time-stamped “January 25, 2016 at 11:16 am” was a reply to mine at “January 25, 2016 at 10:52 am” and was not indented.

        Your post time-stamped “January 25, 2016 at 11:38 am” in reply to mine at “January 25, 2016 at 11:16 am” was indented. I’m now replying to your indented reply. Let’s see if it indents…

  8. I have long pined for a $500-$600 10MM copy of the M1 carbine; to be perfect it would run afoul of NFA regs because a threaded 10-12 inch barrel, integral suppressor and really good folding stock would also be required, along with a top (one only, please) short Picatinny rail for a red dot, a very simple forward light mount, and 20-25 round mags. As long as I’m dreaming, I’ll also dream for it in 10MM Magnum (IIRC, Star may still be making the brass) since the goal is 165-180 grains at 1800-2000 FPS.

    Since so few of us are 10MM fanbois I guess I could settle for a version in 9, but there’s still the SBR and suppressor hurdles to cross.

  9. I have to agree. I’m not an “operator”, I’m a regular guy. I don’t need a $500 rifle with $500 worth of tacticrap on it; I need a $500 rifle.
    Sidebar: What is it with the tattoo-and-beard BS? Back when I was young, if you had tattoos and a beard it meant you were a real cultural outsider; maybe a hardcore biker or an ex-con. These days it means you just lost your job as a K-mart bag boy and think 11 Bush is a landscaping style, or maybe a strip bar in Vegas. To paraphrase one of my favorite movies: “If everyone is operator, then no-one is operator.”.

  10. Slightly OT, A couple of years ago, I ordered a box of 100 10mm cases from Midway. When they showed up, I couldn’t get the dies adjusted right. Turns out they were 10mm Mag. I called Midway and they made it right and I still have a box of brass I have no use for. If anyone needs some, I have a box. cheap.

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