I am sorry to see this is still a thing among some alleged gun people.
I am so glad to see that the economy is so effing good, all Americans can buy a custom-made 1911 from Wilson Combat with a holster made by your craftsman of choice in unicorn hide and rivets of gold.
From the SI article:
I learned that, of all the guns displayed in the store, these were the ones flying off the shelf. Why? Well, despite its MSRP of more than $300, these guns can be found for sale under $200, a price that’s much easier to swallow than a comparable gun nearing three bills…
…Of course, to carry a gun like the Taurus G2C, you need a holster. For those on a budget, Uncle Mike’s has long been a go-to for affordable concealed-carry rigs, and the brand stays true to its consumer base with its latest Apparition holster.
You see, the idea behind the series of articles titled “I Carry” is equipment that people will carry for self-defense and not a effing tactical fashion show to impress your fellow snobs.
When I moved to the States, I could not afford even a Glock and I just happened to bump across a used Taurus Pt-92 relegated to the bottom of a display in a gun shop and just over $200. Truth be told, I can’t remember if it had a spare mag, but the gun and a box of FMJs came home with me. Next I knew, we had a hurricane watch, people were freaking out, (us included) and wild tales of criminals roaming the streets looting were told on TV. It was all BS, of course, but new to the area, we did not know….but screw it, I had a gun.
It was the gun I used when I got started in IDPA and it was the gun I took to my first serious three-day handgun class. It had hiccups and got sent to Taurus for totally free repairs after years and thousands of rounds. And although I carry different and lighter guns with me right now, take a wild guess what’s sitting next to me at my desk doing its faithful duty? The cheap gun I could afford.
A Taurus in hand beats a Sig Sauer in the store’s shelves.
Exercising one’s 2A rights doesn’t necessitate over-extending one’s finances. I started out with a Taurus TCP 738 for carry and have now moved on to a Kahr CW380, but kept the TCP for contingencies.
I’ve never had a problem with my millennium g2. It’s comfortable, relatively small, very grippy, and has 12+1 capacity. Plenty of good to offset the surprisingly long trigger pull. More than a thousand rounds and counting, no hiccups.
I recently replaced the front sight and guide rod with Lakeline llc parts. Good stuff.
If gun control fanatics weren’t idiots, they would propose bans on Hi-Points, Taurus, Keltec, and other inexpensive handguns while using tens of thousands of quotes from the pro-gun side to support their arguments.
“Look, no reputable firearm trainer will allow their clients to use a Serpa holster so surely we should ban them!!!”
Yes, any gun is better than no gun at all. Truth.
However, some brands* expect you to be the Quality Control department- which is why they offer very generous return polices. It’s hoped that enough of the people buying their product won’t ever shoot it, and thus will never discover that the gun doesn’t really work for more than 5 rounds. Or jams on the first shot.
The rule of cheap guns is that they are cheap for a reason- they’re skimping on something to keep it cheap. They will skimp on QC. They may skimp on materials, or maintaining the machinery used to make the items, or the labor they use to make it, or all the above.
The end result is that the reliability of the guns will be a crapshoot- and the cheaper the gun, the better the odds are you are to get a lemon. And like betting on longshot horses, sometimes people get lucky and get a gun that works.
But will the person pinching pennies be able to afford 200 rounds of ammo to function test a particular gun from a manufacturer with a long history of producing unreliable lemons? Probably not.
Now, trying to say that those who recommend against certain manufacturers with long histories of turning out unreliable garbage are doing so because they are gun snobs is a bit strawman-y. Mainly because they will probably own & recommend guns & gear that don’t cost all that much more than the potential lemons, but will have a better record of being free from poor manufacturing.
*Admittedly, that’s most gun makers these day, or so it seems. Be sure to test any gun you expect to defend yourself with!
I had an old Taurus model 605 in an Uncle Mikes IWB holster when I was a broke college kid and got my CCW. I eventually traded up but I bought what I could afford at the Indy 1500.
I don’t have a problem with inexpensive guns. My first was a Smith and Wesson model 659 that I bought in 1987 from an ad in my local paper for $150. I do have a problem with Uncle Mike’s. Their gun sock holsters are trash. You can get a much better holster for not much more than that $10 piece of crap they sell.
There’s a good reason for a lot of snobbery towards the sausage sacks, especially with Glocks and various clones- they’re soft, and a fold of the holster can get inside the trigger guard and cause an unexpected loud noise.
Uncle mikes kydex holsters work just fine, they print a bit more than some holsters but you can dress appropiarly for that. Sometimes that $10 can mean a lot to your budget when your weekly surplus can be measured in change.
Before I could afford anything better, I carried a Taurus PT140. Once I had enough money to buy ammo by the case, I found it to be unreliable. If I wanted a sub $225 pistol and $25 holster, I would get a used Ruger P series and put it in a Fobus holster.
Tam just did a 2000 round test of a P89, with no fancy prep other than a couple of passes with a bore snake and a good bit of gun oil.
Then she shot 2000 rounds with no cleaning, no maintenance, and no failures.
Those things are just plain tanks.
I wish Ruger P series were that cheap, around here even a polymer frame P95 is over $300.
I am astonished, but not surprised, that people are flipping out at the suggestion that an affordable gun is acceptable.
But then there’s a strong undercurrent where you MUST spend mid-sized sedan money on your pistol and training to survive getting up to put on your shoes.
Gods forbid you buy the Wranger cargo pants from Wal Mart instead of 5.11!
Again, there’s a bit of straw man going on. The people who “flip out” are usually not against cheap guns, and will happily recommend similarly priced new models from S&W, & Ruger, or will point them towards quality used firearms.
The point is that not all cheap guns are made equal. And while it is true that a cheap gun from a bargain manufacturer is worlds better than no gun at all, the chances that one will get an unreliable lemon is far, far higher if you go with those makers. This is especially problematic if a person cannot afford the ammo needed to fire the 200 rounds or so needed to find out if the gun is a lemon.
Because one may have the rest of their lives to regret the fact that their defensive weapon went *click* when it was supposed to go *bang*.
Most guns do go “bang” – if they go “click” it’s in most cases (heh) the ammunition. Now that said some guns do have troubles going “bang” *again* 😀
But I had problems with guns all over the price spectrum. Truth be told – most come from sub par weapon handling. Especially “light” pistols tend to jam if not gripped correctly.
Personally, I appreciate SI doing this series on what “everyman” carries. I’ve seen too many videos and read too many articles from “experts” who do one of two things: recommend carrying $1,500+ performance-shop pistols because anything less is garbage and “What’s your life worth?”; or recommend Glocks but ONLY AFTER replacing the sights ($100), getting a trigger upgrade ($150), getting an aftermarket slide release catch ($50), getting an aftermarket barrel ($180), and installing a Crimson Trace green (NEVER the red, which is half the price) laser grip ($350), because anything less is garbage and “What’s your life worth?”
And then ONLY carrying it in a whiz-bang Kydex-and-unicorn-hide hybrid holster ($150) on a steel-reinforced Cobra-buckle pistol trainer’s belt ($120). Because anything less is garbage and “What’s your life worth?”
Sorry. I bought a stock-standard defensive pistol (~$500) and a Serpa holster ($40), which I later upgraded to a very nice Alien Gear IWB. My spare mag is in a Condor MOLLE pouch (~$9 on Amazon) on my belt; I carry my Leatherman in a double pouch, also from Condor, so it blends in.
Some of the snobbier types would likely recoil in elitist horror at my “cheap” EDC gear, but my setup works well for dry-fire and reload drills and has held up to running, jumping, climbing, and tumbling with kids from toddlers to teens (or as we parents like to say, “Life”), so I see no reason to change or upgrade it right now.
And that’s the big thing: No amount of premium or expensive gear will replace PRACTICE. Put another way, almost any EDC gun and setup can be “good enough” if you PRACTICE with it.
I get the perceived value in expensive or upgraded pistols, but I’d only ever carry a good stock gun. I will never have a prosecutor accuse me of “making that gun even more deadly” or “building a custom murder device”, nor have my expensive custom pistol confined to an evidence locker after a DGU (God forbid!).
And I will never have a gunsmith’s bill that exceeds the pistol’s MSRP (Wife forbid!). 😉
Just my $0.02.
I’m on a pretty “snobby” gun forum, and have never seen even the guys with Bill Wilson* on speed dial get super snooty towards people who pocket tote dead stock Glock 43’s, Shields, or 442/LCR’s in holsters made from old milk jugs & duct tape. Or towards those who tote Kel Tec P32’s as a BUG/ NPE gun.
Heck, there was mad props for a guy who did a 2000 round challenge with a Highpoint.
I’ve also seen it argued that any deviation from dead stock on a defensive gun is a potential liability in a defensive shooting.
But the biggest takeaway is you should be spending more time shooting your guns than modifying them, and spend more on ammo per year than you do on new guns.
One thing I’ve noticed about some shooters (myself included) is they spend a whole lot of money on cheap gear. They don’t have just one bargain basement gun they shoot a whole lot, but a whole rotation of cheap guns- none which really work for them. They don’t have a single cheap holster, but a box containing half dozen or more, and none that’s really comfortable or concealable.
*the man himself, not just Wilson Combat
We have a state wide pro gun group here. The facebook page is full of keyboard commandos making the same type of comments. Its sickening to be honest. Any comment made to try and enlighten them and they turn on you like sharks on a wounded shark. One good thing- you know when TSHTF THEY wont be beside ya so you dont have to worry about being muzzle flashed by these geniuses.
I am familiar with that page. I was on it for exactly two hours after joining and donating a fair amount of money to them. I tried to say something, and the response was for members to copy pictures of me, my wife, and my kids from my page, photoshop them, and post them again as a response to the thread.
I left the page, and have not donated a dime to that group since. There are other groups that will put my money to better use.
Reminds me of the “Anything smaller than ‘X’ caliber is useless!” noise. Which doesn’t take into account(among other things) that some people may have problems with recoil, or- especially some older folks- working the slide on some pistols.
On cheap guns- they either work great or they dont. A buddy of mine has a Llama 1911 commander. I took it apart one day, fit and finish was way crappy, BUT!!!! the dang thing went BANG !! every time. EVERY time. I think at the time, late 80s he bought it new for like $175 bucks. If you worried that YOUR gun costs more than that guy then you aint serious. I ran a guy thru one of my CCW classes he had a Sig P226, had lots of issues. Ended up sending it to Sig for repair. Watched a buddy of mine blast thru 400 rounds 9mm with a hi point, no issues.
Done rambling on….