CBMT Tek said to Hagar:
Thoughts on this fiasco?
https://hotair.com/tree-hugging-sister/2023/10/04/sunak-steps-in-it-a-man-is-a-man-and-a-woman-is-a-woman-n582395
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If the left really wants to live in a Star Trek tolerance level of society, why the automatic leap to “hate” and “…phobe?” It is almost as if the left cannot imagine anyone can disagree with them unless they “hate” them. Someone misgenders you, and it is apparently the end of the world. Why? Because the allure of power is too overwhelming, and shutting down the UK PM over a statement he made is power.
Granted, I see that from the right as well, but not as frequently. (Then again, my personal biases may be at play)
So… I have a ton to say and I’m not entirely sure how to say it. Let me give it a go here.
Part the first: I don’t believe it’s as simple as, “A man is a man, and a woman is a woman.” According to Yale, there are two biological genders: male and female. According to some other scientists there are six genders, or 27, or some other odd number. Per the National Institute of Health, there are two main genders, male and female, and other outliers that sometimes happen, but that basically if there’s a Y in the mix of chromosomes, it’s a male, and if there’s no Y, it’s female. These biological genders may OR MAY NOT match the sexual organs exterior to the body. It’s possible, for instance, for a person with both Xs and Ys in their genes to have genitals that we perceive as female, but they are still male no matter whether they have breasts, ovaries, or even female hormones. Essentially, chromosomes are the only way to actually determine someone’s biological gender.
I personally believe that people under the age of 18 should be restricted from making irreversible life-altering changes to their bodies. That includes, but is not limited to, tattoos, piercings, circumcision, sexual organs, etc. Those changes should be made under only two circumstances. Either you’re 18 (old enough to vote, live on your own, and to give consent that is at least somewhat informed), or there’s a medical emergency that requires something happen (such as an emergency hysterectomy due to cancer, or something along those lines). I am somewhat okay with those 16 and older getting piercings with parental consent, but I’d be absolutely fine with it being 18, as well.
I also believe that if a person under 18 wants to wear a dress, then let them. If they want to wear pants, fine. If they want to be called Suzie, go for it. So long as it isn’t interfering in school learning, and doesn’t break a school dress code (which, I should be blunt here, should be 100% applicable to any gender), have at. A kid of any gender wearing a skirt to English class doesn’t disrupt the class unless someone makes it disrupt the class. I don’t care. If a school says everyone has to wear pants or shorts to gym, then that’s fine, so long as it applies to everyone. If bellies can’t be shown, the boys can’t be going around in cut off shirts. Rules need to apply to everyone equally. And there must be some consistency. If you sign up at school as Suzie, then you need to STAY Suzie for the whole damn year. What your friends and others call you is up t you, but if you register under a name, that’s the name you’re stuck with until you register the next school year, with your legal name also being on record. Done and done. Someone makes a mistake about he/she or names, take a deep fucking breath and move on after a gentle correction.
The more fuss you make over this, the bigger an issue it becomes. You cannot stop it happening. All you can do is be a good influence on those it’s happening to. I have a they/them kid. Drives me nuts. As someone with adult friends who have transitioned, I can say that I don’t see the mental issues in my kid that I saw in those friends. But I don’t tell my kid not to use they/them, because there’s no point to it. All that would do is drive a wedge between us, and stop them from talking to me about important things. So said kid wears what they want, provided it doesn’t break school rules. I don’t care. But said kid will NOT do any medical changes until they’re an adult. And because I’ve been open about communication and support, and that I love my kid, the kid understands. They are supportive of this idea, because THEY have been supported. Also, they are going to therapy. Not because “being trans means you’re mentally ill,” but because as a teen, there’s a lot of pressure on you and I want you to get to know YOURSELF before you go changing yourself. And again, that’s been generally well received from them, because there’s no other restrictions or hate or shade thrown at them.
Rules, though, need to apply to everyone. I said it before, and I will continue to say it. So if you’ll let a woman wear a dress and stand in a fountain, then you have to let a man do it. If you’ll let a man join the army, you have to let a woman do it (if they can meet the same criteria, btw… if they don’t have the skills for the job, then they shouldn’t get hired, regardless of what lies between their thighs). You get the general idea. This applies in the other direction as well. I wouldn’t let a straight white woman bare her breasts during a protest or parade, so I don’t want anyone else doing it either. While I am happy enough to be a naturalist by nature, I do so in places where everyone can consent, NOT in public.
With all suggested laws, rules, etc… I ask myself: Would I want Trump to wield this power? Would I want Biden to wield this power? Would I want Harris to wield this power? If I say no to any of those, then I should not be passing the law/rule/whatever. It’s often a Leftist tactic to enact a rule while they’re in office, then try and remove it when the Right is in office, because feelz. That’s not cool.
To go back to the original tack of this discussion, it has seemed to me for a while that many Black folk, and quite a lot of LGBT folk, seem to be wanting to self-segregate. Having fought hard to have the same freedoms, rights, and responsibilities as any other American, they are now pushing themselves back into corners where only people like them are around them. This is counterintuitive, and bad in general. When it comes to trans people, there’s a rather large movement of the rest of us in the alphabet soup who’d really like to see them go away. And that’s a sad thing to say, because generally speaking, it shouldn’t be a problem. If an adult woman decides she’s never felt comfortable in her own body (whether because she has unfortunately got an XY in her chromosomes, or just because mentally that’s how she is), I don’t have a problem with her deciding to become him. I will do my best to remember that person’s labels. Sometimes I’ll mess up, and I’ll apologize, and move on. But I’m not going to get screamed at for forgetting.
I have a friend who is biologically male, and is trans. She has never had surgery, mostly because when her child was growing up, she felt that he didn’t need to be confused. She stayed “dad” until that child was an adult. She still presents as male once in a while, for legal purposes (driver’s license, court stuff). But mostly she wears women’s clothing, make up, etc. She will never, EVER pass as female. She’s six foot tall and has a voice like a manly man. She has stubble. But she’s found happiness, and I’m happy FOR her. She self describes as “a girl with boy bits.” When looking at her, I have visual clues (dresses, make up) to remember she/her. Never a problem. When I think about her, same thing. I think of her in a dress, because it’s how I’ve always known her. But if she is talking and I’m not looking at her… I forget. Because she sounds like a manly man. She’s never taken offense to being misgendered accidentally. People who misgender her on purpose, just to be mean, she simply doesn’t stay around.
Those visual cues are a thing, btw. I have plenty of trans friends from the 90s onward, who did their absolute best to pass as the gender they chose. Some were absolutely horrid at it, and others you’d never have known unless you got into their pants (and in a few cases, not even then, thanks to plastic surgery). But they worked at being the gender they’d chosen. Most still do. It’s the ones that seem to want to “mingle” genders… beards and dresses, for instance, or garish make up with 2 foot long nails… those are the ones I often have problems with. They’re welcome to do what they want, being adults, but I’m going to make mistakes in gendering because there is nothing to base my guess on. If they get upset over that, well… that’s their problem, not mine. Those few are spoiling it for the rest, and it’s a damn shame.
So now I’ve written way more than intended, and I’m going to let you go.
I’m already on record for this subject. No need to restate it. This is a GFZ where I’m packin heat, but in this case will keep it holstered, and simply………..smile, light up a Upmann 1844 Reserve and enjoy the festivities. ?
I was at work today takin a leak and as I was leaving the restroom this “dude” with long grey hair and tits strolls in and bellys up to a urinal… yup I just left. Liberals can’t stand anyone having a different opinion… the only way they know how to react is hate…
This got me chuckling, because from your description, I can’t tell the bio gender of the person involved. Men’s bathroom (I’m assuming curby is male due to the urinal comment), person with boobs at urinal… Could be a male to female who still has a cock, having to pee in the bathroom of their birth gender. Could be a female to male who’s had “the operation” or has one of those neato little funnels (which are great no matter your gender expression, because you can pee anywhere LOL). Not that it matters. The person wanted to pee, they pee’d, you left. That’s exactly what you’d do if it was a “normal” guy, yes? 🙂
Thanks for the insight Hagar. However… I guess I could have written my request a bit more clearly.
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It was not about transgenderism. It was about the immediate jump to “They hate…”
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That single factor is one of the largest chasms between the left and the right. (And, I will stand by that analysis because the accusations of hate almost always come from the left.)
A conservative cannot say we should protect our borders without being accused of hating all immigrants all over social media. A Roman Catholic Priest cannot refuse to officiate a marriage between two men without accusations of hating all gays. Scott Adams cannot say what he thinks about a survey where blacks do not want whites living near them without getting removed the internet. Alice Cooper made the grievous error of expressing the opinion that it is stupid to be giving kids puberty blockers and surgery, and now I cannot find his syndicated radio show anywhere.
Personally, I cannot stand “Pride month.” Not because I want the LGBTQ+ crowd to go back into the closet, or I hate them or anything like that. It is the constant bombardment of PRIDE! everywhere. And, I mean everywhere. I want everyone alive to be proud of who and what they are. But, it does not mean I hate LGBTQ+ folks because I do not celebrate loudly enough. My L and G friends would be very surprised if anyone accused me of hating gays. (And in fact, they cannot stand the constant bombardment of pride everything all month long either.)
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So….
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Why the immediate jump to “hate” or “_______phobe?”
Does the left have the ability to read minds and determine intent?
Or, is it just a way to exert power over others? To force others to their will?
I’m right there with you on “Pride Month”. I can’t stand it, not because I want non-straight people to go back into hiding, but because it’s ridiculously over-the-top and EVERYWHERE.
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And also because the rules should apply equally to everyone. If there’s a “Pride Month” for non-straight people, there should be a “Pride Month” for straight people, and it should not be portrayed as a hateful, _____phobia-fueled bigot-fest (which far too many will).
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At the end of the day, I respect people — ALL people — for who they are, not what they are, and “Pride Month” is a 30-day in-your-face “celebration” of what a small sub-set of the population is, completely overshadowing who the individuals are.
Hitting that nail right on the head. “…there should be a “Pride Month” for straight people, and it should not be portrayed as a hateful, _____phobia-fueled bigot-fest (which far too many will).”
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Why do some (in my experience the leftists way more often than the conservatives) automatically go to “… HATE ______”?
CBMTTek – if you (typical leftist) believe that your opinion is the only right opinion, that your opinion is logical, scientific, moral, legal, and fully justified, then you must believe that all other opinions are WRONG. Not just wrong, but WRONG. And if someone has a WRONG opinion, then it is either because they are stupid, or they just haven’t been told the truth, or at long last that they are not logical, not scientific, not moral, not legal, not justified, and just plain EVIL. If you explain your opinion to them, they should either learn (for the stupid) or have the aha moment for the ill-informed. If they don’t change their opinion after that, then it must be EVIL. There can be no non-EVIL dissent when your opinion is just so righteous.
And you have to have the memory of a fruit fly, because the right opinion can change in an instant, or can evolve (ala Obama on gay marriage), or can simply disappear (like the anti-war protestors the minute a democrat takes office).
Hagar is kind of side-stepping the question with this little “why can’t we all just get along” post. Which is fine, I don’t know her. Sounds like she’s got personal stuff with family and friends and you gotta do what’s right by them. At the same time, for all of society, we need to call out this farce and we need to take the accusations of hate and throw them back on the left.
Just my opinion, based on years of observation.
Excellent post there Don.
Very insightful.
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I certainly hope you were using the plural ‘you’ and were no referring to me individually. If you review my comments on GFZ you will see that I am anything but a leftist.
I will take it as the plural you.
Sorry, guess that was confusing. I was trying to specify a generic “you” when I wrote “you (typical leftist)”. Mainly trying to avoid talking in the third person as that seemed awkward.
Certainly didn’t mean you or anyone else commenting here.
It is what I assumed.
I do the same thing. It can be very confusing to use the pronoun ‘you.’ Sometimes, I say “One will…” to avoid it.
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The written word can be so easilly confused.
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And, great comment by the way. Totally agree with it.
I just want to know when we get months to celebrate the other six deadly sins. I will totally do nothing for Sloth month!
How about an American Pride month? I could TOTALLY get on board with that. 🙂
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The problem with “pride month” in its various iterations is that it allows people to relegate just 1/12 of the year to something, and then they can “go back to normal.” I’d rather we just have a new normal, you know, where people are free. I’m kind of naughty that way.
I’d be down with that. 🙂
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I guess what bugs me most about things like “Pride Month” (along with Black History Months [plural in my AO: Feb and Oct], Hispanic Heritage Month, etc.) isn’t that these sub-sets of the population get a month to celebrate (although as you point out, devoting one month of the year to celebration, and ignoring it the other eleven, is kinda weird). It’s that all the rest of us who aren’t LGBT+, Black, Hispanic, or Fill-in-the-blank, are required to celebrate with them or else we’re haters and bigots.
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Like, can I not just go to work and go about my business in June? No, I cannot; even though I’m straight, I must celebrate LGBT+ Pride and approve of people dressing in distractingly flamboyant clothing. In the workplace. Where sh!t still needs to get done during Pride Month, and I’m trying to do it. I’m happy for y’all with something to celebrate, but please just let me do my job!
The burn on this stick is even with one inch of ash, what a smoke. ?
Added a Hawaiin coffee to my Upman, so smooth ?
Leftists have been able to read minds at least since I reached adulthood. In college, on discussion boards, I’d carefully explain why I believed something, why I supported some policy, and then a leftist would tell me that the real reason wasn’t that I thought welfare or racial discrimination were harmful, but because I was a classist or racist.
The left (imo, of course) knows what they would do in that situation, so they assume the other side would do the same. Since the extreme leftist would use a conceal carry weapon to hurt others when they lost their temper, they assume the conservative would as well. I really and honestly don’t think they understand that the right is currently exhibiting ridiculously good self-control.
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They can’t read minds. They just apply what’s in their mind, to others. If that makes sense?
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I don’t think the *average* leftist is interested in forcing others to their will. I’m certain that there are some in power who are, but that’s another post. The average person, though, just gets caught up in feels. For the left, feels are more important than anything else. That’s why they like giving hand outs instead of hands up. It makes THEM feel good. The media has the left convinced that the right wants to kill all the gays, lesbians, and trans people. There are JUST enough crackpots out there who claim to be on the right, who say the kind of things that get in the media, to make it work.
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I don’t like Pride Month either. I do love my parade (but also supported the Straight Pride parade we had locally, so… *shrug*… I just like parades LOL), but I don’t see it as any different than the St. Paddy’s Day parade. I don’t like African American month, either. Or any month dedicated to things that aren’t for all Americans. A day, maybe. Mother’s Day, etc. But not a month. Morgan Freeman is known for his statement that he abhors “black history month” because there shouldn’t be a “month” for it. History is history, and in America, it involves everyone. Same with Pride. It just is.
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I want to live in a world where there’s no REASON to scream things from the rooftops. I’m all sorts of weird, as my neighbors will tell you. But I don’t go around telling people about it (unless there’s some ethical reason, which does come up once in a while). If they ask, fine. But we’re in New England… if you ask, then you’re responsible for hearing the answer, not me. I’m a soccer mom, who just happens to be into a bunch of other stuff.
“They can’t read minds. They just apply what’s in their mind, to others. If that makes sense?”
That makes perfect sense.
And, I agree with your assessment that most folks on the left (and the right for that matter) just want to be left alone to live their lives.
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It is the small (percent wise, not number wise) that seem to control the narrative on-line. Someone says something they find objectionable, and that person must be destroyed. JK Rowling is a TERF? Seriously? Scott Adams is a racist? Obviously, these people know nothing about either of these folks. but some comments. And in their world, those comments were so awful, their very livelihood must be destroyed.
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What is it with some folks that they cannot tolerate opinions that are different than their own? Perhaps young Mr. Curton hit the nail on the head. When one is so sure they are correct, they will be sure their reaction is righteous.
Since the extreme leftist would use a conceal carry weapon to hurt others when they lost their temper, they assume the conservative would as well. I really and honestly don’t think they understand that the right is currently exhibiting ridiculously good self-control.
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The extreme Left has no sense of self-control; it’s an alien concept. Therefore they can’t imagine anyone exercising self-control.
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They can’t read minds. They just apply what’s in their mind, to others. If that makes sense?
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Makes perfect sense. It’s called “psychological projection”, and the Left’s “mind reading” is similar to their self-control. They simply don’t grok that anyone could have another opinion or way of doing things, so they assume that everyone thinks and feels the same way they do, and would do the same things they would do.
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And when pointed toward evidence there might be more that they’re not considering — such as how 5-10% of the population has CCW licenses and carries regularly, but 5-10% of the population is NOT murdered over parking spaces and neighbor disputes every day — they deflect and obfuscate with claims like, “They just haven’t done it yet.” (Because the extreme Left would, so there’s no thought process that says a CCW licensee wouldn’t; as above, it’s an alien concept.)
“According to some other scientists there are six genders, or 27, or some other odd number” — what scientists are those, what science are they working in, what definition of “gender” are they using, and what evidence do they have for their claim?
I know of only two definitions of “gender”. One is biological (genetic), and there are two. The other is linguistic, where there are (as far as I know) either two or three, in the languages that have grammatical gender (the third being “neuter”, as found for example in German and Latin but not French).
Enjoying my fine cigar even more now, the aroma is euphoric. ?
Feel free to read the links I posted.
I looked for links but I don’t see any related to the specific question I asked about.
Good post. I disagree with a lot but the effort you put into making this is MUCH APPRECIATED and expressed in a thought-provoking way – so I’ll give it some thought!
According to some other scientists…
No. Absolutely wrong. Actual scientists — who follow the scientific method — know there are two sexes and some developmental abnormalities that have nothing to do with body dysmorphia. The people who claim otherwise aren’t scientists — they’re political agitators, selling a lie for the gain of their ideology. They want to make the insane normal and the normal insane — to turn society upside-down so they’re on the top and everyone who does actual work for a living serves them and their ilk. In the meantime they get to pocket wads of cash and mutilate some innocent, confused children.
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There is no kindness in humoring a delusion. All you’re doing is making a sick person sicker, leaving them even more likely to self-destruct when reality becomes obvious.
Robert Crawford, thanks for posting the absolute truth. I put down my cigar just to breathe in the fresh clean air from your comment.
Robert, there is no such thing as “settled science.” Not only are we always learning things about ourselves and the world we live in, there are also evolutionary changes ongoing. I provided links to some information, which people are more than welcome to look at. But to say that a scientist is not real because they disagree with you… nope, that’s just as bad (and in fact the same tactic) as the left. I refuse to accept that. Is it the prevailing view? Not in my understanding. But there is information out there. And I’m only referring to homo sapiens in this post. Other species have many different genders… and that IS science.
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If people want to go out and investigate the importance, or lack thereof, of variations on the XX and XY chromosomes, I’m all for it. I want to know why it’s happening, and for how long, and what it means, and why sometimes XX people have penises, and why XY people sometimes have vaginas. Don’t let your anger and upset and fear get in the way of scientific advancement… even when it makes you scared.
Whats the difference between a chair and a sofa? Thats not a scientific question and no amount of science research is going to answer it. These are categories of things and their definitions come from the language if anywhere. You can scientifically prove that a thing is a chair, but only once a definition has been provided from elsewhere. Science cannot provide the definition.
Lawful2Shoot?,
Thank you for the chuckles.
Any suggestions for a mild reasonably priced cigar?
rd, when you say ‘reasonably priced’ I’ll assume you mean anything under $10 per stick. My daily budget cigar is a Romeo Y Julieta 1875 Nicaragua. Also like anything in that price range from Upmann. Artuo Fuente brand is always good and Dunhill also has some great smokes in that price range. I could go on for hours suggesting good smokes. However my favorites all have price tags of $20 – 50 per stick.
Evidently there is a non-cigar smoker in the midst, or perhaps I didn’t list the brand they prefer. Well, for the sake of space and time I’ll refrain from taking the liberty of going on for hours about how many great cigars there are. For what it’s worth, I do use an air purifier in my office. Hope that helps. ??
Thank you.
And yes, my budget (and taste) is on the plebian side.