David Hogg tweeted this banal hoseshit.
Throughout history violence and war only creates more of itself for example WWI->WWII->Cold War ->Korean War->Vietnam and up to today. While nonviolent moments like Gandhi’s, the suffrage movement or Civil Rights movement lead to peace and long lasting change. Ours will too.
— David Hogg ? (@davidhogg111) April 30, 2018
Really? Is he high?
Non violence is effective ONLY when your opposition is very, very civil. That is because you are asking those oppressing you to stop, trying to appeal to their better nature or to defeat them with shame.
Gandhi accomplished what he did, only because the time was ripe for it. Empires were no longer fashionable after WWII and too expensive to maintain. The Germans and French were giving up their colonies in Africa. France and Britain were pulling out of the Middle East. Britain couldn’t rebuild itself after WWII and control nearly a billion people in India, so gave up India.
The British also knew that cracking down hard in India just after defeating the Nazis would not be a good image.
The American South was the same. Yes, southern (Democrat) governors and sheriffs fought civil rights protesters with fire hoses and police dogs. In the grand scale of history, that is pretty mild and civil. In other countries, soldiers would have been mobilized to open fire on the protesters with rifles. Then how far would the civil rights movement have gotten?
History tells us the answer. It looks like the treatment of the Armenians by the Turks, the Jews by the Nazis, the Ukrainians by the Soviets, the Great Leap Forward, the Killing Fields of Cambodia, Tutsis in Rwanda, the chopping off of hands in Sierra Leone, and the mass murder of white Farmers in Zimbabwe and South Africa.
That is what happens when the oppressor decided to be savage instead of civil. All the pickets and protests mean fuck-all diddly-squat when the oppressor has a rifle or a machete and has no compunction against using it.
I am reminded of the quote from Starship Troopers by Robert A. Heinlein:
“I was heaping scorn on an inexcusably silly idea — a practice I shall always follow. Anyone who clings to the historically untrue and thoroughly immoral doctrine that violence never settles anything I would advise to conjure up the ghosts of Napoleon Bonaparte and the Duke of Wellington and let them debate it. The ghost of Hitler could referee and the jury might well be the Dodo, the Great Auk, and the Passenger Pigeon. Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor, and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Breeds that forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and their freedoms.”
I just find Hogg’s platitude to be ironic and self serving.
He had called for violence to be used against law abiding gun owners. So I guess what he really wants is for us his side to be non-violent so we will be non-violent, at which point he can pull a rope-a-dope by becoming violent (or having violence done on his behalf by people tougher than he is).
My usual answer to the idiots who sanctimoniously proclaim “violence never solves anything” is to remind them that Rome settled the problem of Carthage permanently with extreme violence. If one really studies history (not the History Channel version), one could argue that the whole WWI leading to WWII etc, could have been stopped in 1918 with the application of even more violence. Instead of agreeing to an armistice, the Allies could have driven the Germans back to Berlin and ended the whole “stab in the back” lie.
I always find peculiar how the Left develops memory loss after specific dates they imposed on events. The Anti War Movement has no relevance or consequences after the Fall of Saigon. There is no mention of the mass evacuations to the sea into what few in history remember as the Vietnamese Boat People. Nor the mention of the Khmer Rouge and the genocide in Cambodia.
And with Gandhi,, the Brits capitulated, independence was achieved and then some crazy guy killed him apparently without reason. End of story. They do not mention that the newly formed Indian Government did not have anybody ready to take over basic services, no police, no military to control the partition of Pakistan and in the next three months, the biggest refugee crisis of the modern times happened: 10 million displaced people with more than half a million killed in first three months.
The Indian government was forced to call Lord Mountbatten to take over government secretly and fix things till the new government got their shit together.
Again, the Great Sage and Moral Philosopher, Col. Jeff Cooper (Masters degree of History): “One bleeding-heart type asked me in a recent interview if I did not agree that ‘violence begets violence.’ I told him that it is my earnest endeavor to see that it does. I would like very much to ensure—and in some cases I have—that any man who offers violence to his fellow citizen begets a whole lot more in return than he can enjoy.” – Col. Jeff Cooper
from: https://survivalblog.com/editors-quote-day-309/
I’m trying to remember the alternate-history short story where India is conquered by the Nazis and Gandhi tries his non-violence technique with them. That lasts about 2 days.
Then again, there are some good Gandhi quotes (real ones, you can find the primary sources) opposing gun confiscation and arguing for armed self-defense when needed.
Also, last I looked the “Cold war” wasn’t a war, it was peace enforced through sufficient arms.
Non Violence works with governments that have morals.
“She’d always talk about how great Gandhi was. I’d tell her the only reason Gandhi survived after his first protest was that he was dealing with the Brits. If Stalin had been running India, he’d of been dead in a second, his name forgotten.”
― William R. Forstchen, One Second After
Spent a good part of the day looking for this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Last_Article , http://harmanjit.blogspot.com/2011/06/last-article-by-harry-turtledove.html
Thanks! Yes, that’s the story I was trying to remember.
YVW. I read it years ago in F&SF magazine and remembered it clearly. I bet that blogger is getting a shock from the hits to that page.
“Had the Japanese got as far as India, Gandhi’s theories of “passive resistance” would have floated down the Ganges River with his bayoneted, beheaded carcass.” — Mike Vanderboegh.
Violence is NEVER the answer…..but when it is, its the ONLY answer.. I believe it was Tim Larkin who said that..
Funny how idiots like (camera)hogg cant see the difference between self defense and random violence. What? You shoulda went and talked to Cruz hey?
He woulda just put down the gun right?
Looks like Hoggy is snorting again. Does anyone understand hoggy snorting? I suppose those that listen to his grunting do! I think he wants to project his hoggy way for two reasons. One, Jews won’t touch him because he’s a pig and Moslems for the same reason. I guess you’re safe for now. Oink! Oink!
JKB:
Thanks so much for the Heinlein quote. I read Starship Troopers in 7th grade and it made a big impression on me. I am grateful that Heinlein is read by millions of people to this day. He was definitely a top- notch philosopher, among all his many talents.
On can avoid violence on most occasions by complete capitulation. If you offer no resistance, there is no need to offer you violence as a motivator. Those who enjoy offering you violence, will still do so and you have zero protection from them. Your opinions will not be your own, your possessions will not be your own, your body will not be your own. You will not represent ANYTHING worth anyone fighting about or over. I choose other.
Capitulation is not as effective as its proponents pretend. Crime statistics indicate that the best way to avoid injury as a crime victim is resistance with a gun. Capitulation is more likely to get you injured. Worst of all is resistance with a weapon other than a gun.